145. From $30k in Debt to $7 Million in Assets with Michelle Rule
In this powerful episode of Money Mindset Hub, your host Carla Townsend sits down with Michelle Rule, investor, wealth mentor, co-founder of an IT business, mum of two and creator of a multi-million dollar asset base.
Michelle shares how she went from $30,000 in personal debt to building $7 million in assets, creating a legacy and lifestyle on her terms. She breaks down the mindset shifts, asset strategies and identity rewiring that changed everything.
What you’ll learn in this episode:
• Why income is not the key to freedom; assets and alignment are.
• The “Three Wheels of Wealth” framework Michelle uses to scale and sustain.
• How to rewrite your money story and stop following outdated rules that keep you stuck.
• Practical wealth-building moves tailored for women, mothers and soul-led entrepreneurs who want more than just business success.
If you’re ready to step into a new identity, build wealth that lasts and align your money with your purpose, this conversation is your blueprint.
► Connect with Michelle Rule:
– Website: https://www.michellerule.com.au/
– Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/michellerulemillionairemaker/
► Connect with Carla / Money Mindset Hub:
– Website: https://www.moneymindsethub.com
– Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/moneymindsethub
⚡ If this episode resonates, please LIKE, COMMENT your biggest takeaway, and SUBSCRIBE to stay updated on more wealth-building conversations like this.
#MoneyMindset #WealthBuilding #AssetRich #FemaleInvestor #MichelleRule #MoneyMindsetHub
Watch the full episode below:
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Hello and welcome back to the Money Mindset Hub podcast. I'm your host Carla Townsend, a money mindset and success coach for purpose-driven entrepreneurs who are ready to dissolve their money blocks and create a life and business that they never want to escape. And today I have the incredible Michelle Rule with me, who is a Perth based mom of two wealth mentor, investor, and co-founder of a successful IT company. In her mid twenties, she was the youngest executive at a corporate advertising firm before she burnt out, haven't we all? So she left that role deep in debt and craving a most.
Spacious life. A few years later, after creating their own family business and navigating the emotional and financial toll of IVF, she and her husband welcomed their first child. That joy was followed by a confronting moment when they sat down to write their will and realized their son would inherit almost nothing if something happened to them. At the time, they only had a small amount of equity, minimal super, and had only recently cleared 30 K in personal debt. despite earning well and running a profitable business, they were still living paycheck to paycheck with no real assets or wealth to pass on. And that moment became her turning point. So since then, they have built $7 million in assets, including a $4.4 million property portfolio across multiple homes and grown their IT business to a 2 million evaluation while enjoying family travel and a values led life. Michelle is passionate about showing other women that is possible to rewrite their money story and build legacy wealth that aligns with how they want to live, not just what they want to earn.
Thank you so much, Carla. My goodness. What an introduction. Thank you.
Honestly, are so many different avenues there and so many things as I was rereading that, that I know that so many of the listeners are going to really understand and relate to as well, there's so much in that. I think one, your IVF, you know, that is such a big toll financially, emotionally, mentally, everything.
There's such a big toll that goes into that. But then also that real awakening moment too, of realizing that what are we gonna pass on? Like what do we actually have to pass on to our son? And I feel like, and maybe you're the same, but I feel like things really change and shift when you have children because it puts it all into perspective.
You're not living for yourself anymore. You are living for them. And what you do create, or even, the lack thereof to a certain point, it's really going to go onto them. It's going to either set them up or it's going to be a hindrance. So you spoke about that pivotal moment when you realized that he was going to inherit almost nothing.
So what was that shift that happened inside of you in that moment, and how did that help you in redefining your relationship with money?
Gosh, I love this so much. And look, it makes me emotional just to revisit this moment because like you say, as a mother and all of my energy, my husband and I, our energy was towards. IVF to having this baby, to getting this baby earth side. And then to actually be sitting in those early months with this beautiful, precious newborn.
And my mind started to shift. I was looking at this small human and that feeling of it is now my job. My job is to take care of you forever. And that is a huge responsibility. But also your whole mind shift starts to zoom out. You start to look at your life and what you've done with your life and how will you raise your kids and what will you be telling them about what they can do with their life and the goals that they are able to achieve, you know, and want to teach my son that he can have and be anything that he desires to be.
But then comes the moment where you self-reflect and you take stock on your life and you think, hang on. Did I become everything that I wanted to become? Or somewhere along the line did I dilute my dreams, dilute my goals, because I came up against challenges, or I came up against mindset blocks or people perhaps that would just say, you've got enough, like settle.
And had I settled? Yes, I had settled. And although it's a, it was a painful moment to realize that at some point I had stopped on big dreams. I had settled, at least in those early months with my baby. I could at least take a moment to decide what I was gonna do next.
And I talk about this decision energy with my clients all the time because the power of deciding something different is coming for you, then that's the moment that it happens. So yes, for me, that was with my baby and for me, that was. Realizing that I had let money go. I had somewhere along the line decided that I was no good at money, that I was just no good at saving.
I couldn't accumulate it. And so I was on this paycheck to paycheck cycle and I just settled. But for my son, I wanted more. And so that was the fuel that I used to start my whole wealth creation journey.
Yeah, and I feel like so many, let's say mothers particularly because it is majority women that listen to this podcast, but I feel like there is that moment where so many mothers go, am I doing? What am I actually gonna create? And what happens, and maybe you felt this too because you have a couple of children as well, but I feel like there was that rebirth moment each time they were born.
You know, there's that moment with your first and then your second. And for me, again with the third, it was just like this awakening of something just completely shifting and changing in you. there is that big amount of pressure too when you do have children. You know, you want to give them everything, but you also want to, not necessarily materialistically, give them everything, but you want to give them the lessons and the learnings and the strategies and the mental resilience to actually be able to go and create what they want and also to not feel like they have to be stuck in some box. I know that was a big one, and I know you obviously came from corporate, as did I, when are really just shown one way from school through to your career. You know, you go to school, get good grades, go to uni, get a great paying job, have a family, and then that's success. But you obviously felt like there was this resistance there.
You settled, and I hear that a lot too. I've settled and this isn't actually what I wanted, and it's not coming from an ungrateful standpoint or anything. Of course, we're so grateful when you have your beautiful babies and you realize you are so, so blessed in so many ways. it's also okay to want more.
Absolutely. You know, and really what, what that was teaching me in that moment, because, you know, prior to that, I'm an energy queen. I had already gone deep into reiki healing and I had healed my life and got out of corporate and really found so much peace and happiness in my life. But what I hadn't done was actually healed my relationship with this energy of money or just money, right?
And so I realized in that point, by me ignoring money, by me trying to pretend like it didn't matter, I don't say that anymore. I don't say that money doesn't matter anymore. I actually give money the power that it can change my life. If I can accumulate money in a way that feels good to me, I can free up my time.
And I think there's no greater power as a mother to know that you are not bound to a job and you do not have to trade your time for money anymore. If you can learn the mechanisms of how wealth is created, that will actually give you more freedom. So once I started to link, okay, if I can crack this code on wealth and if I can heal my relationship with money, that will equal freedom.
So that in itself was a complete mindset shift that made me realize if I can do this, this is gonna be good. This is good for my child, this is good for me, and it's no longer okay, I'm good with doing without. It's like, I got rid of that. Put that idea in the bin. I'm not going to go without. It is not to wear that as a badge of honor.
Like I don't need more money as a badge of honor, or I can just go without, no, it was, I'm actually going to stand grounded in my beautiful human energy and work with money. I'm gonna embrace it. I'm gonna welcome it in, and when it comes in, I'm gonna do incredible things with it and show my son and my now two children that we get to co-create our lives.
We get to have so many choices and freedom because we now have welcomed in money.
Yeah, and I think there's so much power in that too. Like you said, there's so much power in the decision. But I think also for anyone listening right now who does have young children, it doesn't matter what age, but I think that we've gotta remember that the lives that they're growing up into, the opportunities that they have didn't exist, they have so much opportunity right at their fingertips.
And maybe they don't understand it yet, but they will in time. And I think it's up to us to be able to teach them and coach them, mentor them into seeing how much opportunity there actually is. And that, yes, you do get to control your own narrative and write your own story. And it does always come back to money. You know, always, always, money's always linked to success. And I think for most of us, we want to feel successful and that means something different to all of us. So I think quickly on that, what is your version now of success?
Well, and just firstly before we even go into that, I think you've hit the nail on the head with this generation and the next generation truly being able to be the complete change makers, and this is where there's no judgment on how we experienced our childhood. Our parents or our grandparents, really did go through hard financial times.
It's okay to say, you know, my generation, I'm going to embrace multiple millions and I'm going to call that in because I can, and I'm going to teach my children how to take that and go more and amplify that wealth, but also no judgment to the generations that came before us. My parents were beautiful, incredible humans, and they worked hard.
They're teachers and they did what they knew to do, which is get the career, save the money, pay off the mortgage, and that's that. You know, and the generation before that went through even harder times. So like you say, we are now in absolutely different times. So it's so important that we are empowering our kids with this information.
So look, and I guess I would say success, what a huge word, but success as a soul led human would be to live a life in service. I do feel very strongly, even as a. Financially free, self-made, soul led, multi-millionaire. Like I could quite literally just do nothing, watch Netflix all day. But I have absolutely no interest in doing that whatsoever.
I get great meaning out of my service. So I would say success would be having freedom over your time and how you live your life and where you live your life, like that ultimate sovereignty over your life. But also to be able to follow those intuitive nudges and that soul calling to serve and to help and to contribute and to leave a legacy.
So whatever that is, that just, you wanna wake up and it just drives you. And it's not about trading time for money anymore, like we're beyond that now. It's, you get to become fully sovereign over your life. To me, that is ultimate freedom and ultimate success.
I couldn't agree with you anymore. I think the freedom to choose how you spend your days because you are set up, because you have made the decisions, because you have been through the hard times and you've built that resilience and you've also built the belief system that it's possible and you can do it. That will serve you forever. I love that. So you mentioned there that living paycheck to paycheck cycle, so I know that women are still stuck in that battle. Why do you think then, it's such a common pattern and what's the first step into breaking it? What would you say?
Yeah. And listen, absolutely no judgment. I can feel what that is like. I have been there, I've lived it for many, many years. So the mindset shift, the one mindset shift really, that I was gifted and I feel that I was just given the right set of circumstances that just led me to that moment with my son, where I zoomed out from thinking income only and paycheck to paycheck.
That income cycle, that chasing more income, something switched in my brain when I realized, hang on. It's wealth, it's, we are zooming out from this. We actually need to understand how wealth is created. When I'm talking wealth, I'm talking, I'm talking assets. I'm talking purchasing things that will grow. So putting your money to work, like calling money in and then putting money to work so that I'm not trading my time for money anymore.
And then I'm using the money that I have brought in initially to go purchase assets that will then go work for me. So now when I look at, and this is where I started my net wealth map, I started to think, okay, I'm no longer just chasing more income. I want to understand how to build my wealth. And so now I have a free calculator that I have on offer for anyone who wants it.
But this is really where we just take stock. What is your net wealth number? And then how can we grow that every year? So rather than just thinking, how much can I earn every year? 'cause it's earn, burn, earn and burn, it's how can I look at where am I today in my net wealth and what am I gonna do this year that will grow my net wealth?
Knowing that if I can continue to focus just year after year, month after month, to just ever so slightly increasing my net wealth, that eventually I'm going to be in a position and that happens. Seemingly overnight, but bit by bit where you're in a position where your assets, my assets earn far more than even my successful IT company now in cash.
So my assets are growing out there, hundreds and thousands of dollars a year in just growth. Now, it doesn't even seem fair, right? Is that even fair? That we can hold assets and they will make us wealthier? I didn't work hard for it. I didn't trade my time for it. Well, this is the game of wealth.
But also the fair part is as many women as can hear this message, you get to play that game too. First you need to know it exists. And then you need to know, well, how do I build wealth? Right? And this is why we're out here having these conversations to hopefully turn those lights on. But it is available to absolutely every single woman or man who wants it.
So before we dive into, I suppose, what that looks like in terms of building wealth, because I think for so many people they just think, well, how is that even possible? I first wanna start with where I truly believe that at all happens first is really understanding your belief patterns because your beliefs are always going to dictate your actions. So what old beliefs about money did you have to unlearn in order to actually become orientated, growth orientated in terms of you're gonna turn your money into assets that are going to build wealth for you.
I love this so much because firstly, we must be, we must be the person who can have the thing, right? So really, and I know this sounds, it sounds however it sounds, but I became the multimillionaire years before I actually became the multimillionaire in the way that I thought about money, in the way that I was planning towards accumulating it in the most healed and respectful way towards it.
So, listen, I was guilty as a younger person of absolutely believing that people who had more wealth than they seemed to need were greedy. I did. I just, whether it was what I was told or just something in me that just felt that everyone in my environment that was struggling, that was working really hard seemed to not have as much money yet I could see as a small person, there were other people that seemed, this is just my perception not to be working.
I don't believe this to be true anymore, but I felt like they just seemed to have the thing, and I was perhaps angry at that. I was frustrated at that. Why did they just get to take the holidays and drive the cars and live in these big castle like homes is what a young version of me thought. Whereas we were over here, why can't I live in that home?
My parents are working so hard and we can't have that. Why? So I actually formed an anger towards people with money and looking back it. I don't judge myself for that, but I realized that that was actually repelling money because let me tell you, if you feel any type of way, anger, resentment fear judgment around money there, it just is no capacity for it to come to you.
It wouldn't, it just naturally wouldn't because it's a thing that you don't desire. So why would we be attracting anything that we don't desire? It's not the way it works. We have to firstly want it. So actually, like you say, the very first step is having a moment with yourself. And I call this just like drawing a line in the sand, just a day one with this idea that you are ready to have a brand new relationship with money.
That you are ready to open to the possibility that as a good person, as a soul led person, that you are going to do amazing things with money. You are not going to do any type of awful thing or become any awful person. You are actually going to be, become you. Exactly. You, but amplified, amplified in your ability to be generous, to serve, to help, to allow all that to flow to you, and then you can give in that overflow state.
So I would say the belief that I now have is the more money I have, the greater my capacity to serve, the more money I have, everybody in my environment benefits from me not having. I don't serve anyone from me being in fear and lack. I'm useless to anyone. So actually it's a very selfless thing to say I am going to call money in because we all have the opportunity to do it.
So I'm gonna spend my energy learning how to either develop the skills that I need to call it in, or learn the information that I need to build it and amplify. I'm gonna do that. I'm gonna put my intention and my energy into actually calling it in. It's my responsibility to do so. And when I do, I'm gonna do the most incredible things with money.
Like just watch me, like watch me circulate and flow money to everyone in my environment. How can I make my environment, my family, my friends, my community better with the money that flows to me? Sorry, it's a subtle but absolutely powerful shift and it will completely change the way that money reacts to you.
Yeah, I love that you went there too, because it truly is your triggers. And most times when people feel triggered, they instantly go to their default pattern, which is to sit in that anger, to sit in that frustration rather than seeing their trigger as, hang on a second, maybe your triggers aka your shadow is saying that's actually what you want.
It's actually showing you some of what you want. Rather than pushing it away, start to notice it and say, Hmm, what about that makes me feel that way? is it that, let's say if you see people on Instagram celebrating these big cash months and these beautiful holidays and all these things, and it makes you feel a way that you're not proud of, maybe the question is, is it because I want some of that? I want some of that? But do I just maybe not believe yet? I can have it. And again, like you touched on at the beginning, you've gotta become the person who believes, one, that it's possible, and two, that you're worthy of it. Because money all comes back to that self-worth and obviously what you were taught.
But again, you can always unlearn what you learned. And I think the most beautiful gift of being a woman and being a mother is that you will do beautiful things with it, but sometimes it's just hard to fall outta that default pattern because you've done it for so many years. But yeah, I, I love that because it's truly the truth.
And the thing is, at the end of the day, it's so much further beyond us. It's not that if us, by us looking into our triggers and actually asking ourself, is that something that I want you then get to help your children? To form those core beliefs that it's possible, not that it's greedy, it's evil, it's bad, you shouldn't have more than enough. You can teach them that it will amplify the beautiful characteristics that they are that it is possible. So I saw that you mentioned this idea of your queen account, and I wanna go there go there
because I want you to share how does this work in practice, having this guilt-free spending system? Because spending money, guilt-free, as a mother particularly, especially when you're on maternity leave, and maybe you don't have the income coming in, or you're just in the beginning of your journey with creating wealth, there is that guilt, there is that shame and there is that lack. how can you explain your idea of the queen account and the guilt-free spending, and how did that all
absolutely. So yes, everyone needs a queen account. We're all gonna open a queen account after listening to this. So essentially understanding that everything is energy first. Okay? So we understand everything is energy now. What is going to draw money to me versus what is going to repel money away from me?
And when I'm talking money, I'm talking abundance, I'm talking opportunity, I'm talking meeting the right person who will open the right door. Like the feeling of being open and abundant versus being closed off is a different energy. So guilt and shame is the lowest vibrational energy. It will close you off from opportunities.
It'll close you off from money. It will absolutely shut the door. So if you were sitting in guilt and shame. That is not an open space, so we need to kind of move you out into an open space. Just like a flower. I like to sort of imagine. Yeah, like a flower. Like it's if, are you all closed up where the bees can't find you, the opportunities can't find you, the money isn't coming?
Or are we actually open all the way up in this state of just curiosity. I wonder where my next opportunity's coming from, but I'm ready to receive and this really is the energy of pride, but it's not an ego pride. It's of just a openness of feeling good. A, I can stand tall, I'm taking care of myself, I'm ready, I'm deserving, and I'm willing.
So if we think about these two, that guilt and shame is going to repel money away, and that pride and feeling good and taking care of yourself is going to attract more opportunity, money people and places and things to you. Well, how do we get there? So now, somewhere along the line, I started doing the Queen account before I even understood the energetics behind it.
I started a Queen account because I was a strict budgeter, desperately trying to get out of credit card debt. So I had racked up $15,000 in credit card bills, even though I was in a high paying advertising job and I was 25 and I was just, every month there wasn't enough. So I had just, I had to become what I thought.
I had to become a budgeter to figure it out. So somewhere in those
early days, I developed this queen account because I needed to figure out what was I gonna allocate to me to spend, and what part was my husband gonna have his king account to spend? And what part went to living expenses and costs? So I still actually categorize all of the money that comes in and out.
I'm a cashflow. I love to flow cash. I don't save, I don't hoard. I don't hold on tight. I flow so I know exactly how much money is coming in every month because all of my bank feeds come through. I use Pocket Smith. You can use any app to just track and it's not a shameful experience. It's a tracking, flowing, empowering data collection experience.
Yes it is.
And I know exactly how much cash is coming in and I make sure I have money flowing to my Queen account. Now. Over the years, my Queen account has grown and grown and grown. Of course it has because the more we grow and the more we take care of ourselves, the more opportunities open up to us.
So my Queen account now is used for anything and everything to take care of me. That is the purpose of money and abundance is to sustain us. It is sustenance on the planet. It allows me to make choices that feel good and exciting to me. Now, the reason that I work with clients and say, you need a queen account, and you need to decide just one monthly amount that is gonna go in there just to side the amount and make peace with it.
However, small or large, just pick a number and make peace with it. Now, once it enters your account. Zero guilt. We must take the guilt away. From the moment we are tapping the card to spend on ourselves, we must give ourselves full permission to actually enjoy the day spa. Enjoy the coffees in the morning, enjoy the yoga class.
Like whatever it is that is on your highest value at the time you are swiping the card to spend, you've already decided to spend that money. So the guilt does not come with you. So you'll see me on my Instagram on my shopping trips now. Now it's intentional spending. I love a wardrobe. I just do. I've always been that way as a little person.
I'm not doing it for anyone other than myself. I love clothes. I love to dress up. I love to take care of myself. It makes me feel like a queen. So when you see me out there, I'm not just randomly spending, I have allocated money for that experience. Now, when I'm on that trip, I'm enjoying every minute of it.
I'm feeling the clothes and the textures and the colors. I'm not thinking, what's the price tag? No, I've already decided to spend this money. So the Queen account concept essentially is once you've decided, you've decided that is going to be spent on you full permission to go and do that. Now, whether you wanna pull it up over a month or two or three to get a bigger thing, that's fine.
Or if you want the daily coffees and all the things, do that too. But it's on your terms and it's intentional spending.
we are so aligned in this because we do this exact same thing. So I am also the cashflow queen, so I know you, you have to know exactly what's coming in and what's going out and allocate to spending. So I get this, I've had this question so many times, family, friends, clients, all over the years, but I've always said to them, I believe that you can do it all, all at once when it comes to money. You can save, you can invest, you can spend, you can pay the bill, you can do all that stuff all at the same time, but it's about understanding what's coming in and where is it going, and where is it being allocated, and automations
And you're mixing. So in that process, you're mixing strategy and energetics and isn't that so beautiful? So it's not about ignoring the fact that there are numbers attached, it's data. We do need to understand the data, but we need to create freedom and space around the data.
And when you can mix the two, the strategy and energetics, it's like you are unstoppable. And that's where we wanna be.
Oh, a hundred percent. A lot of the time I find with women in particular, it's this avoidance pattern that comes up, but it's the same as feeling shame and guilt around your money. Because if you are avoiding it, when we think about money as a relationship, if you avoid a relationship, if you avoid your partner, how do you think that relationship is going to stand the test of time? You can't avoid it. And the only way to be able to build that safety within you and to, I suppose, regulate yourself, your nervous system, so you're not freaking out when you open your bank account, is to actually start looking at the numbers, is actually to get comfortable and have a plan. So what you're saying there too, and again, so aligned on this, and I love that you say this because I've always called it like your money plan.
Like a budget. I know it has a funny connotation with budget, right? And a lot of people don't like it, but I just think flip that word. It's a money plan. It's a plan for your money. You know what's coming in, you know what's going out, but you still get to enjoy yourself and enjoy your life. You do not have to live in scarcity. Whereas I see when you're living in scarcity, there's just enough, but you never get to spend on yourself. And it builds up this resentment. And again, like you said, it's all energetics, isn't it? So you don't want to feel like that. And then that's where the guilt and shame comes from when you're spending, but you're like, oh, but I haven't allocated for this, or what I find too sometimes is there can be this, it's so strict, the budget is so strict, and then you have a blowout. And of course you're gonna kick yourself if you're having a blowout and you haven't allocated for it. So again, like, I love this because it money gets to be simple, but money needs to have a purpose.
And if you have a plan and you set up your queen account, you set up his king account because you both are contributing, right? And even if you're not, even if you're not, even if you're a mom right now listening and you desire to have a business and maybe you're on maternity leave and you haven't got there yet and you feel guilty spending the money, don't, don't, don't do that. You need to still be able to spend on you because then that's how you fill up your own cup. And again, I feel like we often forget how much our energy impacts the entire home. And this is just a huge part of it. And you see it, you know, I'm sure you'll see it too. One of the main reasons why couples separate is due to money. And it's so sad when it can be avoided.
Goodness. Yes. And it's like the way that I look at it, you know, because at different times in my life, my husband and I have earned different, you know, there was a stage in my early twenties where I was starting to outpace him and then, he's over in it and then he starts his company and then I stopped working to, you know, heal myself.
I was burnt out. Adrenal fatigue, right? So I think it's so important to, if you are in a relationship, that you look at it and I just look at it like an empire vibe, right? We are building an empire together. So however you wanna contribute to that, whether we are contributing by taking care of the kids and creating a home like that is so important.
Now, money, when we open to abundance, money might start flowing in through your husband's company. Now that doesn't mean that you didn't play a part in welcoming that in, because by you providing a safe, wholesome environment that is also contributing too. So in terms of spending, it doesn't mean, oh, I only earn this much, so I can only spend that much.
No, we are a ecosystem. We make decisions as a family and we make sure every single person in the family gets a seat at the table. Absolutely. So important.
Oh, so important. So let's go into the wealth building because I know there's gonna be so many questions women just sitting there going, okay, so, but how do you do it? Where do you start? What do you do? What sort of investments? Obviously none of this is financial advice. Please go and get your own financial advice and do your own research.
But this is just, you know, our own experiences, I suppose. But for you, I'd love to know where did that all begin and what sort of investment strategies have you dabbled in
Yeah, absolutely. Look, I'm here. I'm here, and I'm an open book, and I preach my Netwealth number on my Instagram every single day. Does it feel stretchy and like scary? Yeah, a little bit, but the thing is, if I don't speak the numbers and I don't actually break it down and make it like real life, then it just becomes this mystery behind a curtain that is not going to help insert anyone.
So I want to absolutely be able to have these conversations, right? Because I would've benefited from hearing this back when I thought I was failing at money. I wasn't failing at money, I didn't have the knowledge that I needed, didn't have the information yet that I needed. Okay, so investing is amazing. Now I've talked about assets and the reason I love assets is because that is how we can filter cash into a system that is gonna grow on autopilot. So assets are these beautiful things that grow and grow and grow in value over time. That will accumulate whether I'm awake asleep on holidays, wherever.
Now, the importance of assets is incredible, insane. Like if when I look at my numbers now, the hundreds of thousands of dollars that come in from just asset growth, if I had understood, like I thought investing was maybe a nice to have, but it's not a nice to have. Like it's an essential. And yes, your superannuation, okay, cool.
Paying off a mortgage, cool, well, you can do it that way and you can live fine. But if you wanna live a life of maximum impact. Amplify your wealth because amplifying your wealth is how you get to have more impact on the planet. So this is where I went, right? I can see the net wealth plan if I just pay off the mortgage and accumulate super, it felt like I get to retire at 60 and I'll have superannuation just enough cash to last me until I pass away.
That didn't excite me very much. I'm like, no. I do like to push the envelope a bit, but I just hadn't done it in money. So, okay. How did I start? So I started in, now there's lots of different types of assets.
Now. Property for me has been a beautiful starting point because property, it's not that property is better than shares and I'm a more, is more person. I'm like have shares, have crypto, have property, have super like, have it all, have an additional income stream, have more businesses like hedge your bets, have all the things.
But property's been a beautiful way to start my portfolio because it's allowed me to use leverage. Now, if there was no such thing as leverage, and I'll explain that in a minute, I would've perhaps picked the stock market. It's a bit simpler than property. Property. I'm dealing with property managers and tenants for the most part.
I've got five investment properties now. So for the most part, the property managers manage everything. I don't need to do a whole lot. I just check in on the financials every month to make sure we are checking cash flow for each property, but that's that. But leverage this beautiful thing called leverage.
We can either be angry at the banking system, which I was for many, many years. I was so annoyed. I thought, how do banks get to just print out a number on a screen and charge people interest and like, can I start a bank? Like I wanna be a bank? But here's the thing, this is the system that has been set up, the monetary system.
It can either be a cage and it can keep us stuck, or we can learn the rules and play the game and empower our families. So leverage means I can take a couple hundred thousand dollars, or I can take some equity out of a property I already maybe live in. I can take that smaller pocket of cash, I can take it to the bank.
And with that 100,000, $200,000 cash, instead of just putting 200,000 into the stock market and getting growth on 200,000, the bank is gonna loan me the rest. And now I get to hold a bigger piece of the pie and get growth on the whole thing. So I might get growth on a six, $700,000 asset. So leverage has allowed me to use less cash.
To purchase bigger assets, to get growth on bigger assets and therefore snowball my net wealth year after year to now, you know, the 7 million within the decade, which would never have been possible without leverage. And so I started out in property. We purchased a property, waited for the equity to bill, purchased another one, waited for the equity to bill, so we weren't even using cash deposits.
I always say to women who come to me, I understand what it's like to start starting, is the trickiest, hardest part of the entire wealth game. But you'll never regret starting. You do have to start. It's, it is. It is hard. I get it. It can be hard. We can even reframe that doesn't have to be hard. You might already be sitting on enough equity in your home where it's not hard.
I've had clients come to me, they have a full paid off mortgage, and they're literally sitting on so much opportunity, they just didn't even realize they could use that to go purchase more properties. So starting out, you just need to start. But once that wealth train starts to snowball, then it gets easier and easier and easier and easier until you start to get to this point, which is where I got to where I sort of can see the way that this all works and I need to spread the word and I need to empower other women to start investing.
So starting investing, you know, would look like. Getting some financial advice. Like we really need somebody to come in to look at our numbers, whether that's a financial planner, you know, they're amazing at looking at your superannuation, looking at all of the parts that you own. When I'm purchasing property, I use buyer's agents, so I'm not just randomly picking, I use experts that study the data, right?
Brokers, mortgage brokers that are gonna help you get good deals rather than dealing straight with the bank. So all these things, building a financial team around you so that it's not scary. And I just want women to know that they can absolutely do this. Like I, my husband was busy building this company, and although I was helping out when it came to investing, he didn't have the time or the bandwidth.
So I literally took it on from day one. I've always been the one to meet with all of my financial team, and I love it. Now it's just picking up the phone and chatting to your team and figuring out what you're gonna do next. So it's absolutely so achievable for all women.
I love that. And the thing is exactly what you just said, you just have to start. And I think what stops a lot of people from actually starting is they don't know where to turn first. But like you said, it just starts with talking to some experts. Go and chat to a financial planner. Your accountant is possibly one or has one on their team.
So that's a really great place to start for anyone listening. If they think, you know, maybe that is something that they do wanna get into. I think it's amazing to have a diversified portfolio and properties. That's ours. Like that is our biggest plan overall. But I think that there's just so much growth there and there's a lot of data, as you said, there's a lot of research of the growth over time and over the decades. So it does seem, you know, I know investing can sound a bit daunting, a bit scary, but the numbers are there, the data's there, the stats are
there. You can check it out. Just find a great broker. Find, there you go. Buyer's advocate. Speak to your accountant, speak to a financial planner. Then they will get you on board with your plan, like specifically for you. So I love that you just said that because it, it doesn't have to be that hard, and you need to know what steps you need to take in order to get there.
And that's, that's it. Like you just start
And I joke because often, you know, a lot of my wealth has been created from just signing on the dotted line. Yes, I need to understand it, but this is where, you know, I'm so passionate about helping women and standing side by side as they embark on this journey is because it's just about understanding what questions do I ask in the meeting?
What might they be asking me? It's like just to make it so easy and so seamless so that they feel empowered going into these meetings and they're learning and they're having the discussion. And there's a sounding board there, right? Because honestly, half the time you'll see more my social media. Oh, signed another piece of paper.
Oh. Had to get that form through. Making more money. Making more money. Like money. It is, it's wild to think how it happens, but better that we know how it is built so that we can build it too, so that we are in the game too. Then that's the way to do it.
You've just gotta get started and start to ask, and don't be worried about not knowing, because financial literacy is really not something that we're taught in schools. It's something that you learn just through asking questions, and there's no such thing as a silly question, especially when it comes to financials.
If you're not in that world, you haven't been in that world and you have no idea, don't be worried about it because you're not gonna be the first person to ask those questions.
Exactly, and wealth is not built in isolation. I just, I couldn't preach that loud enough. Like companies aren't built in isolation. Wealth isn't built in isolation. It is not about you doing it on your own, being out there working harder than ever on your own. It's a teamwork experience.
So the better the people on your team, the greater your opportunity to create it. So yes, team, team, team.
Yeah. Love that. And I suppose when it comes to properties too, in particular, obviously it does come with. Debt Now, however you wanna look at debt, but I know that's a big scary thing sometimes too. So many wo women do struggle with debt and the shame that comes with it. So how do they then shift their energy when it comes to taking on big investments like that, that are attached with debt? Obviously there's an end game and there's a plan, but what would you say for the woman that would love to do that? It's been on her list of things to do. It's in her vision, but she's just so scared to see that debt amount.
Look, and I get it because I was in the camp of pay off your mortgage and that's freedom. So let's paint that scenario. Imagine you have paid off your mortgage. Is that freedom? Where's the money coming from? You have a home to live in. No mortgage. Where is the freedom? Where's the wealth coming in?
It's not, right? We just have a home to live in. It's really just to understand how, what your net wealth map would look like and just map it out. Map out. If you don't take on the debt and you don't in invest in property, you don't have to do property. You could do shares and just use your cash.
But I think what you're gonna find, once you start to invest, and even if you're just using cash and building up your share portfolio, you are gonna start to realize this, the mechanisms of assets, and you're gonna think, oh, there's more potential there. So it is kind of like, well, yes, I'm taking on debt, but I have an excellent cash flow system.
So helping, like you say, a personal cash flow system, yes, your accountant is gonna help you in your business, but do you have a bookkeeper for your personal cash flow? And if you don't, you need a system. Because until we feel safe with what numbers are coming in and going out towards maintaining these investments, then of course they're gonna feel scary.
Of course, millions of dollars of debt is going to feel scary, but what if you had millions of dollars of debt and you knew the exact amount of cash that you need for the next 12 to 18 months? Flowing in, flowing out? It's already ticked off. This is the way I run my properties. They are already set and sorted for the next 12 to 18 months.
They've got the right buffers in each of the offset accounts, so that I just quite literally check in, have a little check in. Yep. Everything's still running. At the end of every month. There's zero stress because I understand how to flow the cash, I know what they need to be serviced.
So it's nearly like, it's just, if you've got good systems and you understand, like you say, cash flow, and you understand how wealth is built, the systems will create safety. The systems will give you that regulated nervous system. I'm not in danger. All is well, everyone has what they need, right?
And then the pocket of money that is flowing through your home, that you have everything you need. So I think with that sort of structure comes safety. So I would say, yeah, if you're feeling nervous about taking on debt, I would say it's because we need to still run the numbers. We need to still look at what's it really gonna look like month to month, and do we have the cash reserves for that?
And quite often you might have enough equity where you can take that additional equity as a cash reserve to run the properties, right? So we're not even talking, having to go out and earn more money to run the properties. We're just talking about what do we need to free up in cash to maintain the portfolio.
Yeah, again, a plan equals safety and security and there is always someone you can ask. There is always someone going through it and there are always your team that you can reach out to when you aren't sure. And I mean, I suppose to, when it comes to properties as well, it is an asset. So worst case you can sell, one should you need, and it's probably made a lot more money and you'll be fine.
So there's always comes back to that option as well. Just quickly then, looking back on your journey then to accumulate those properties, I'm sure along the way you've had hiccups and things like that where things haven't gone to plan.
Are there any that you can share, any lessons for anyone that's really looking to embark on this property portfolio journey as well?
Yeah.
let's do it. Okay. So don't do what I did. 1, 2, 3. Okay. So, all right. There's, you know, there's a bunch of things and you don't know what you don't know, and then you live and you learn. Amazing. So I would say, first of all, before you start purchasing property, you wanna be having a discussion with your financial planners, accountants about what entity you're gonna purchase that property in. Right. So because it's gotta be different tax implications depending on who owns the property. And by that I mean is it in your personal name? Did you personally go out and buy the property or did you purchase it in a trust or through a company or, there's a many ways to purchase property.
So before we even buy, we wanna be chatting and figuring out what entity, because once you've already bought it, now we've got, one of our homes is in our personal name because we thought that was. Our home. We're just buying a home like everybody else. You just go to the bank, get the home. In order to move that now into a trust, we'd have to sell it.
And then it's an investment property now. So we'd be paying capital gains tax on that if we wanted to get it out of our personal names. So it is just, these are just things to think about. So what entity is purchasing the property would be number one. Just have a think, have a chat to your advisors.
Come up with a game plan. And in order to make those decisions, you really need to have a goalpost. How much asset are you driving to? What's the overall plan? So knowing even I work with women on their financial freedom number, how much asset are we accumulating? Are we accumulating 1 million? Are we heading for 5 million?
Are we heading for 50 million? Are we becoming billionaires? Like what are we, what are we, where are we even going? Because that's gonna change the way that we purchase and our assets. So that would be number one. Number two would be okay. It's the long game. Three years in to me becoming a property investor, we had already created hundreds of thousands of dollars of growth in our asset.
And for a woman who had been in debt most of her life, to me, all I could see was dollar signs quick. We need to sell them like we've made hundreds and thousands of dollars on these properties. Like let's just quickly realize our gains. We need to, we need to sell and cash out. Thank goodness I didn't because it truly is a long game investing.
Now, those properties that had made a couple of hundred thousand dollars have now doubled and more in so hundreds and hundreds of thousands of dollars extra in growth because I've held onto them. So I would say you are going to come up against brand new mindset throughout your investing journey. Think long term.
If you've built growth, it might not be the time to just sell and cash out and take the cash. It might be a more smart idea to hold those assets and think about that long-term plan for the assets.
Mm.
So yeah, I'm really glad that I didn't do that. I thought let's sell everything and just buy the Dream Home mansion.
You know, like we've made it, we've done,
Yeah.
years later I think, thank goodness I didn't do that.
So yeah, think about it. It all comes down to the big picture plan. So what do you wanna build? And that's gonna change what assets you purchase. It's going to impact the entities that the per, that the assets are purchased in, and it will.
Dictate when you're when, or if you're gonna sell your assets. Now our five investment properties, buy and hold. We have no plans to sell them. We wanna keep them within the family empire, right? 'cause we are building this with generational wealth. So knowing that we'll change the type of asset that we buy.
And it changes your mindset around how you are holding onto that asset too.
Mm. I actually love that you started there, depending on the entity, because most people go to your personal name,
Yeah.
but there are pros and cons for each. It obviously depends on your plan, that was probably one of the most important things that you said.
So I heard this quote from Yogi Berra a long time ago, but she said, if you dunno where you're going, you'll wind up someplace else. And I love it because you have to know, you have to have that clarity and that direction. And again, speaking to people who understand and can walk you through pros and cons and what is the long-term vision, because especially when it does come to things like investing, it isn't an overnight like yeah, get in now and in 12 months time you're gonna make it, it obviously does take time. But yeah, I love that you started there because it is not often advice that is given to even think about what entity, whether you do it in a trust, whether you do it in your personal, whether you do it through your company. There are all obviously so many different ways you could, but I love that you started there.
It's so, good. And something to first consider for anybody going into it.
I love it. And that overall vision, because, you know, our, our goal was a $5 million asset base. This, this seemed like a far out there stretch goal. Like how on earth, you know, we had barely anything to our name, but we decided if we got to 5 million, that would be absolute dream goal. So we put that number in and we decided that five to six properties would get us there.
Now listen, we've done that in a decade. And more, you know, because business has taken off as well, and then we have that asset as well. So I just think it's worth giving yourself an aspirational goal, and it's worth really giving it a shot because once you start, you just might find that you're a lot better at it than you thought you would even be, and that you love it even more and that your desire to then go bigger and create more impact, it'll start to fuel this beautiful dream and you'll go on to create it.
You absolutely will. So don't count yourself out wherever you are starting at. If I can go from 30 K debt to the 7 million asset, you can absolutely be anyone and do this.
Oh, I love that. So quickly then, for the woman listening who's feeling like wealth is still out of her reach, what is a really powerful truth that you would like her to take away from this conversation?
Straight to mind if you're listening to this. There's a reason I'm such a firm believer that we are put in the right rooms when we are ready to hear the message. So if you are actually sitting and listening to this and there's that spark, that fire, that desire that something within you that thinks, look, I don't know the how yet.
I don't know how that would be possible, but there's a part of me that would really love it. There's a part of me that actually would desire that. Then that is it. That's the key. That is the clue that it is absolutely for you. So why you might not know the how, the mere fact that of all the billions of things you could be doing right now, you are listening to this message.
I would say if it excites you, that to me is that internal compass saying there. That's the thing. Go for that. You can do that. So if I can plant that piece of hope, it's all you need. It'll absolutely drive you. So just go for it. Take that first step. You just never know where that whole staircase will lead you.
I love that. I do love that. And I feel like that's gonna be so different for everybody listening.
What is a book that has deeply impacted your life?
Oh, so many. Now I could say, 'cause I'm a spiritual queen as well as a money queen. So I could say journey of the souls was this spiritual book that I read that completely blew my mind on just what we are here to do on this planet. As a soul led woman, I started to zoom way out into my soul's mission.
So journey of the souls, it will, it talks about all of the spiritual elements. Read it if it's for you or you feel called to read it. I was never the same after reading that book because I started to understand that. And for me, I believe that I have, I go from lifetime to lifetime. So my soul comes with me.
So what am I here to learn in this lifetime? It gives me permission to fully send it and to fully embrace all of the learning in this lifetime takes me out of, out of front and flight. So that's incredible. Now, in terms of money, I would say
Dr. John Demartini, the Ultimate Wealth Library. Now that's actually an audio series, mind blowing.
It's free, I believe, on Audible, Dr. John DiMarini. I hope I get to meet him one day. Absolute legendary person. His view on wealth creation and money is extraordinary, and it truly goes into a lot on energetics, but a lot as well on how we build out wealth. So that's another incredible one. Yes.
Hmm mm. I love those. Last question, if you could give one piece of advice about money to your younger self, what would it be?
Oh, I love this. Okay, so little Michelle would've believed that she was deserving of all the things, but somewhere along the line, society told her it wasn't for, a person like her. So I would actually say to little Michelle or little version of you, yes, if you desire it, it's because it's for you. You wouldn't desire it if it wasn't in your path.
So looking back now, realizing what I've created, there was a part of me that knew, which again, comes back to this point. If this is resonating with you, it's because it's for you. You can't be resonating with something that is not for you. So my one piece of advice would be go with it. Trust it. Trust that gut instinct, and just see where it leads you.
Yeah. Yeah.
And on that note, thank you so much for coming on. Now all of your links are gonna be in the show notes as well, as well as to your incredible calculator and your podcast. They're all in the show notes, so please go and check them out. But thank you so much, Michelle, for coming on. And I also just wanna say thank you for the work that you're doing in this world because I think it's so beautiful and I love how many women like you that I'm really connecting with, and we're all the same wavelength when it comes to money and success and what's possible. So on behalf of all my listeners and everyone that's ever come across you, just thank you for what you're doing and keep doing it because you're doing amazing and we need more kindhearted women in the world with deep pockets like you to spread this message so that more say that it's possible as well for them.
Gosh, thank you so much, Carla. Honestly, vibe attracts your tribe, so thank you. I'm glad our universe has collided, and thank you so much for the opportunity to speak today.
Thank you so much for tuning into today's episode. I really hope that you enjoyed it. And be sure to subscribe so that you don't miss any of the incredible future episodes and guests that we have coming up for you.
The world needs more kind-hearted, women like you with deep pockets. I'll catch you in the next episode.